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Inherent Contradictions
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 23:21:52 -0600
To: AM-GLOBAL
From: "Paul Paltrow"
Subject: Inherent Contradictions
Baba
"Tamasa' ka't'iche bihag d'akiche, purva toran'e khuliche dva'r..." (P.S.
4647)
Purport:
By His grace, today in the eastern horizon the sun has come, the birds
are chirping with full joy, the darkness has gone. The crimson dawn is
rising-- everything is beautiful; everything is charming. The door of a new
era has opened.
O' my brothers and sisters, everyone get ready. Do not remain drowsy and
in a state of slumber-- Arise, awake. O' children, boys, and girls of the
world, break the jail of dogma and staticity and come out.
Now it is our duty to fulfill those great tasks which were started by
sages in the past. We have to remain vigilant and keep the lamp of
neo-humanism effulgent forever. By Baba's grace today all the darkness and
staticity has gone; a new brilliant era has come….
== US DEMOCRACY: INHERENT CONTRADICTIONS ==
Namaskar,
In the wake of the current economic meltdown, to some degree capitalism is
coming under fire, yet the glory of democracy is still soaring. However,
we know that this is short-lived.
Prout is the ultimate socio-economic system, this we all know; yet in this
present era still "everyone" is running after democracy-- mistakenly
thinking that "D" is the panacea. Of course we A'nanda Ma'rgiis are aware
that on so many points Baba has openly exposed the loopholes & weaknesses
of democracy. So the theory itself is faulty. And, in the practical realm
also, here in this present world, the 'bastion of democracy' itself is
riddled with hypocrisy-- therefore making it nothing but a 'Mockery of
Democracy'.
TWO POINTS
Here are two points that are raided in this letter. The first revolves around
voting rights and the second centers on indigenous cultural expression.
MACRO PERSPECTIVE
At the same time the greater overall picture is that the US again & again
likes to herald itself as one of the 'great civilisations'-- the essence of
modern democracy. However, those living within and without the US and
especially those living in so-called Third World nations should not naively
view the US as being on some high pedestal. It is not like that: The USA is
not a great nation. Rather each and every day more of its loopholes and
failures are getting leaked onto the scene.
ESSENTIAL COMPONENT OF DEMOCRACY: RIGHT TO VOTE
Everyone on the planet knows this essential fact that the most fundamental
point of any democracy is the right to vote. Indeed the world democratic
leaders pride themselves on this ideal and when toppling any totalitarian
regime or guerilla-style government, those same US / world leaders proclaim
that 'let the people vote in their new representatives and / or president'.
How far those elections are fair and just is another matter. Here the basic
point is that democracy and voting go hand in hand. One is inextricably
linked with the other. Where there is no voting there is no democracy; and
where there is no democracy, voting is not a way of life.
USA CAUGHT IN ITS OWN NET
These days one after another fire is being lit on the US political stage.
All of which undermine the "sanctity" of the US democracy. One such point
is voting rights and why certain citizens in the US are not granted the
right to vote.
In particular the discussion is roaring how those behind bars-- i.e. those
in jail-- in most cases are totally denied the right to vote. According to
US policymakers, just because those citizens did a big or little crime,
then they have totally lost their most basic democratic right: Their right
to vote.
And then, interestingly enough there is another splinter in all of this.
Namely that many behind bars are falsely accused and wrongly sentenced to
US prisons. And in that case also they lose the right to vote.
Of course the US is comprised of 50 states and this debate of whether
prisoners are allowed to vote or not is whipping all around from east to
west & from west to east. And the laws vary from state to state.
In the large majority of states those in prison automatically lose their
franchise-- that is they cannot vote if they are behind bars. But not only
that some states take it one step further: Even after those prisoners have
completed their jail term and are now free to live in society, still they
are not given the right to vote. Such ex-cons remain disenfranchised. Here
is but one classic case from a recent study:
"In 2000, the study says, [the state of] Washington disenfranchised an
estimated 160,000 felons, of whom 144,000 were out of prison." (Seattle
Post Intelligencer, Jan 30 2006)
And like that in each and every state there is some sticking point whereby
in countless cases US citizens are denied the right to vote.
It is no different from how things were in the past. Contemporary
politicians are quick to laud and praise the US as being the greatest and
longest standing democracy in the present world. Yet what they fail to say
is that at the beginning only white land-owners were given the franchise--
no one else could vote. And it took nearly 200 years for the ball to come
full circle (or nearly so) where women, blacks, and youths (18-21 years
old) could vote.
And still today the same claims are being made: That the US is the greatest
democracy of all time yet now our prisons are more full than ever before
and nearly all those inmates are disenfranchised, i.e. denied the right to
vote.
Hence in all the circumstances the US is besieged with hypocrisy and
contradictions. Then how can anyone think that the US is the greatest
democracy on earth, past or present. Yet this is the false billing that the
US gets as it convinces more and more developing nations to formulate a
democratic system based on the glory of the US.
MANY COUNTRIES GRANT VOTING RIGHTS TO PRISONERS
In contrast there are many, many nations around the globe which openly
grant voting rights to prisoners and encourage the democratic electoral
process. These countries include: Israel, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, plus
dozens and dozens of other nations.
WIPING OUT CULTURAL EXPRESSION OF INDIGENOUS PEOPLES
Yet not only is the retraction of voting rights indicative of the US's
tainted effort in establishing a true democracy. The US also has a horrific
track record with regards to the treatment of native peoples. Everyone is
well aware that in the contiguous 48 states of the US, the red-skinned
native peoples (i.e. 'Indians' )were savagely and brutally destroyed. And
up in the state of Alaska the same genocide was carried out against the
Eskimos.
The ruling elite of the US not only burned the bodies of those native
peoples but also buried their songs, dance, history, and all their cultural
expressions. This is the well-known and proven fact. And now the leaders
and chiefs of these indigenous communities are trying again to raise their
flag and point out the outrageous sins committed against them by the US
government. Unfortunately it is a little too late. Already permanent damage
has been done. The US has effectively wiped out those native societies and
severely broken their backbones.
Yet in their hypocritical stance, nowadays as the "spokesman" of democracy,
the US strongly condemns leaders like Mugabe and the Chinese
government which cracks down on ethnic minorities. So wearing their big
boots of justice the US firmly proclaims that local and native communities
should have their rights represented and protected in those countries. So
in the world arena the US is quick to point their fingers at others in
hopes of making themselves look good. But on their own homefront, the US is
shackled by their own dogma and hypocrisy.
Hence on numerous accounts and multiple ways the US democracy just cannot
stand on its own two feet. Externally the US tells one thing and within
their own borders the opposite is going on.
BABA'S PROUTISTIC SAMAJ SYSTEM FAR OUTSHINES US DEMOCRACY
So from head to toe, Baba's Proutistic form of government is far more
advanced and unquestionably more neo-humanistic than the present day
democratic systems. For starters, included in Prout is Baba's samaj system
which automatically honors and preserves the cultural expressions of all
peoples. Native linguistic expression is looked upon as the cornerstone for
preserving their legacy. And in totally all the 'ways of doing' of
indigenous communities is given deep value. Hence on this point and many
others Prout is the model of social justice-- far better than any of the
standing democracies like the US.
BABA REVEALS THE FACT ABOUT THE FIRST DEMOCRACY
So while the US likes to bask in being the originators of democracy, in one
of His epic discourses on democratic life, Baba has revealed the first
democracy was formed in India in the state of Bihar by the Licchaviis.
Baba says, "The Licchaviis of Vaishali abolished the monarchy and
established the first republic about 2500 years ago. The representatives of
the people were known as Licchaviis, and they formed an executive body
known as Mahalicchaviis through elections. The Mahalicchaviis controlled
the power in Vaishali that was previously controlled by the monarchy." (PNS)
Thus where is there scope for the US to go pounding its chest and
proclaiming themselves as the torchbearers of democracy.
BABA'S BLESSING
Here following is Baba's divine blessing that the day is not far when a
Proutistic form of government will take shape on this dusty earth.
Baba says, "PROUT is the panacea for the integrated progress of human
society. It aims to bring about equilibrium and equipoise in all aspects of
socio-economic life through totally restructuring economics. Without PROUT,
socio-economic emancipation will remain a utopian dream. Only PROUT can
save the world." (PE)
Namaskar,
Punya'tman
Note 1: THE BBC REPORTS ON US "VOTING RIGHTS"
'Prisoner voting: world views'
"Overall, 48 states [out of 50 in the US] deny the vote to serving
prisoners, 33 disqualify parolees from voting, and eight even bar
ex-convicts from the ballot box. Only two states - Maine and Vermont -
place no restrictions on prisoners."
"Conviction rates among ethnic minorities in the US are much higher than
rates among white people. As a result, a much higher proportion of black
and Hispanic people are excluded from the vote."
"This has prompted criticism and even several lawsuits claiming racial
discrimination - particularly in Florida, where it is estimated almost
one-third of black people are denied the vote."
"The state was crucial in deciding the 2000 presidential election in
favour of George W Bush and his Republican Party. Many in the defeated
Democrat Party blamed the disqualification of ethnic minorities -
traditional Democrat voters - for their loss." (BBC, 28 April 2005)
******************************************
Jada (Crude) Samadhi
Baba says, "Suppose, one is a great yogii but if there is no love for his
goal, then those suspended propensities are finally converted into crude
matter, that is, the subtle human existence becomes like iron, it becomes
like wood, it becomes like sand. What a deterioration! What a downfall!
This particular type of yoga where a yogii does not bear love for the
Supreme Entity is called 'hat'ha yoga' in Sam'skrta. It is dangerous for
the human elevation." (AV-2, p.18)
******************************************
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Namaskar
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Baba nam kevalam
Baba nam kevalam
Vinay will turn AM retreats into sex workshops !!!!.
ReplyDeleteon list owned by ananda nirupama and jitendrananda, liila & harideva, satya, dharmamitra they talk about sex. spending time like this.
Steve Vinay Gunther
From: Steve Vinay Gunther ch...@gestalt.org.au
Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 08:18:26 +1100
Local: Thurs, Nov 27 2008 8:18 am
Subject: Sex
Namaskar
I am generally loathe to have any more emails coming into my inbox.
But I am giving a little bit of space to see how this list pans out.
Lets talk about something really interesting that generally doesnt
get much airplay between margiis, like sex. Is that an ok topic for
this list?
Its a bit of a non-topic in AM. Baba mentions very little apart from
having some restraint, doing it in moderation, and men not
ejaculating more than once a week. Apart from that, this fairly
important area of life seems to hardly exist in any kind of
collective discussion. Theres so much we could talk about.....
I am happy to get the ball rolling with all sorts of dimensions, but
do want to check first if its too R rated a topic for this list.
Vinay
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Northern Rivers Gestalt Institute
15 Coleman St, Lismore,
NSW, 2480 Australia
Ph/Fax (02) 66 213 911
ad...@gestalt.org.au
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Satya Tanner
From: "Satya Tanner" satyatan...@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 07:05:07 +1100
Local: Fri, Nov 28 2008 7:05 am
Subject: RE: Sex
Namaskar,
I think that this is a really good idea. We need to be exploring all
aspects of the ideology with a critical mind, including those parts that
are a bit more "taboo". As far as content goes, I see the main thing is
that we are exploring it in a way that is beneficial and helps our
understanding of the subject matter whilst keeping within the listed
guidelines.
Religion, politics and sex – the three taboo subjects for any dinner party.
Yet in my opinion probably are three that cause a lot of problems (ie
exploitation) because they aren't discussed properly.
As for sex, my curiosity lies around the reasons for the rules listed
below. Particularly with reference to women. I understand that they are
based around lymph formation, but how does that apply to women given that
we have ovaries?
And another area which I think is important yet rarely discussed is
repression of sexual desire. I'm aware that this can be quite an issue
for some WTs (although not only WTs). I'm guessing that Baba gave tools to
deal with this rather than repress feelings (since he spent a lot of time
talking about how bad repression is for one's psychic welfare)… In fact
suddenly you can see that this has wider implications beyond just sexual
desire – every desire.
Satya
Steve Vinay Gunther
From: Steve Vinay Gunther ch...@gestalt.org.au
Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 12:43:54 +1100
Local: Thurs, Nov 27 2008 12:43 pm
Subject: RE: Sex
Namaskar
Yes, on a technical level, the rate of men's
ejaculation seems to have nothing much to do with
the frequency of sex for women. Baba doesnt seem
to mention this at all. And even the question of
ejaculation doesnt seem to me to have much to do
with the amount of sex if a man is able to not
ejaculate every time. Thats something that took
me a number of years to work out. I used to
think, once a week was the recommended frequency
of sex. But that wasnt enough for me, and I doubt
its enough for a lot of people. Ejaculation
control is something that the Taoists and others
talk about. I had never heard it discussed
amongst margiis, but then sex doesnt seem to be
discussed much at all.
So if this takes away the question of frequency,
what else can be said from a margii point of view?
Desire - thats kind of tricky. Why have sex if
you dont have desire, well apart from
procreation. It seems to me to fall in the arena
of living life in the relative world. We have all
sorts of desires - a new computer, nice clothes
etcetc. Unless you are into living a kind of
ascetic existence, living in the world seems to
have to do with finding a way to live peaceably
with desire.
Apart from being fun and pleasurable, sex also
obviously has a lot of other benefits. Its a
binder in relationship, and can provide for a
range of emotional needs. Again, coming back to
the Taoists, it can also be a vehicle for
summoning energy in the body, and then directing
it upwards.
Its kind of wierd that tantra in the west goes
into this in quite some detail, but the topic is
eschewed in AM. I have always steered away from
the tantra as its presented in the west, which is
almost entirely about workingn with sexual
energy. But recently I have been willing to
investigate it, and found theres actually a lot
of really good stuff in there.
Vinay
roy paulse
From: roy paulse roy_pau...@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 15:58:11 -0800 (PST)
Local: Fri, Nov 28 2008 10:58 am
Subject: RE: rtananda
okay bye me
Steve Vinay Gunther
From: Steve Vinay Gunther ch...@gestalt.org.au
Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 22:37:46 +1100
Local: Thurs, Nov 27 2008 10:37 pm
Subject: RE: Sex
I am interested in hearing some responses on this subject from others.
Some questions:
* what tensions might you experience - between the need for sex, and
ideas about being spiritual
* how do differences in level of need for sex get dealt with by margii couples
* how does sex differ for a margii and a non-margii - what does our
spirituality add in terms of context, support, direction etc
* what kind of problems in relation to sex arise for margii couples
that may be unique to being margiis
* how do you fit together the physical drive, the need for emotional
depth, and the living out of spirituality?
Then there is the issue of celibacy, and acaryahood. Where this
works, then its a great thing. The redirection of sexual energy into
sadhana and service. But where does this become too hard, and what
happens then? I doubt that any acaray will personally talk about such
senstive and personal matters on such a public discussion list, but
these are certainly topics which need to be aired.
I can certainly say that as a margii, over the years, I have
encountered a number of situation of acarays no longer being willing
to stay in their celibate role, and I have had to deal with this
directly. When I was younger I had no idea what to do in such
situations, and was not able to really be of much assistance. In more
recent times, at least on one occasion, I have been able to support
an acarya to deal with their sexual cravings and stay with their
role. A mixture of kindness, firmness, honest discussion, and a lack
of reactiveness helped. But then each circumstance is unique.
Lots to talk about!
Vinay
--
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 11:08:55 +1100
Local: Sat, Nov 29 2008 11:08 am
Subject: RE: Sex
namaskar
It would be soooooo interesting to have a workshop about this, don't you think?
Would you like to do a workshop during retreat or mela or something, Vinay?
I think this is an importanat and very interesting topic!!
But I don't feel like talking aobut it and discussing about it online.
because i believe it is important that among the people who would like
to do discussion that we have understanding that things that are said
in the dicsuccion stay in among us and words belong to the people who
said them and not to be repeated outside of the group, you know.
otherwise i do not feel emotionally comfortable or safe. moreover, i
dont find it very interesting to discuss things online compare to real
discussion in a group.
thanks
Steve Vinay Gunther
From: Steve Vinay Gunther ch...@gestalt.org.au
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 18:14:25 +1100
Local: Fri, Nov 28 2008 6:14 pm
Subject: RE: Sex
namaskar
yes, I can apprecaite what you are saying.
Yes I would be willing to run such a workshop. I am intersted in
hearing from people on this list, regarding what are the kind of
workshop conditions which would help you feel comfortable exploring
this topic.
I would certainly set some paramaters for such a workshop - i would
not want people coming and going at random as it takes time to build
up an atmosphere of trust, and possibly do it in two segments over
two days.
Interested in getting input
v